My adviser wants to be the first authorMentor trying to be first author?How to define author order of a...

If the Captain's screens are out, does he switch seats with the co-pilot?

Best approach to update all entries in a list that is paginated?

It's a yearly task, alright

Why must traveling waves have the same amplitude to form a standing wave?

Is it ok to include an epilogue dedicated to colleagues who passed away in the end of the manuscript?

What wound would be of little consequence to a biped but terrible for a quadruped?

Should we release the security issues we found in our product as CVE or we can just update those on weekly release notes?

Plywood subfloor won't screw down in a trailer home

How is the Swiss post e-voting system supposed to work, and how was it wrong?

What is the blue range indicating on this manifold pressure gauge?

Provisioning profile doesn't include the application-identifier and keychain-access-groups entitlements

When were linguistics departments first established

validation vs test vs training accuracy, which one to compare for claiming overfit?

Why does Deadpool say "You're welcome, Canada," after shooting Ryan Reynolds in the end credits?

"One can do his homework in the library"

Replacing Windows 7 security updates with anti-virus?

Can the druid cantrip Thorn Whip really defeat a water weird this easily?

Deleting missing values from a dataset

Does splitting a potentially monolithic application into several smaller ones help prevent bugs?

Force user to remove USB token

How does Dispel Magic work against Stoneskin?

Does Linux have system calls to access all the features of the file systems it supports?

Unreachable code, but reachable with exception

Can infringement of a trademark be pursued for using a company's name in a sentence?



My adviser wants to be the first author


Mentor trying to be first author?How to define author order of a collaborative paper where all authors have contributed equally?Adviser wants to be joint first author, even though I did most of the researchHow to get rid of unwanted and annoying co-author?What should I do if the first author wants me to write the whole paper?Should a collaborator who recently passed away be included as an author?What's the best way to inform a supervisor of collaboration on papers with a different professor?I wrote the whole paper, but did only a very small part of the research. PhD student wants to be first author, but didn't write. Is this okay?Lab tech had research project that is now being developed by honours student: Who deserves to be first author?First author submits manuscript before final approval of all co-authors













4















I am working on a paper after finishing my Masters. I did all the lab research and writing of the manuscript. My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments. Can I argue with him and tell him I am not letting the article to be published if he insists on being the first author?



Thanks!










share|improve this question







New contributor




user105565 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.

























    4















    I am working on a paper after finishing my Masters. I did all the lab research and writing of the manuscript. My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments. Can I argue with him and tell him I am not letting the article to be published if he insists on being the first author?



    Thanks!










    share|improve this question







    New contributor




    user105565 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.























      4












      4








      4








      I am working on a paper after finishing my Masters. I did all the lab research and writing of the manuscript. My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments. Can I argue with him and tell him I am not letting the article to be published if he insists on being the first author?



      Thanks!










      share|improve this question







      New contributor




      user105565 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.












      I am working on a paper after finishing my Masters. I did all the lab research and writing of the manuscript. My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments. Can I argue with him and tell him I am not letting the article to be published if he insists on being the first author?



      Thanks!







      authorship






      share|improve this question







      New contributor




      user105565 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.











      share|improve this question







      New contributor




      user105565 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.









      share|improve this question




      share|improve this question






      New contributor




      user105565 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.









      asked 4 hours ago









      user105565user105565

      211




      211




      New contributor




      user105565 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.





      New contributor





      user105565 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.






      user105565 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.






















          4 Answers
          4






          active

          oldest

          votes


















          2














          Occasionally (and more than occasionally in private / Ivy League institutions), professors will have their names credited as the primary author of a paper that was produced by their graduate advisees. In my view it is unethical, but in the eyes of some academics, it's customary. Some professors view their advisees as underlings to further his or her brand recognition in whichever field he/she works in.



          in my view, your advisor is in fact not the author, if it's true that you did the research and literally wrote the paper. Before confronting him about it or giving him an ultimatum, I would go to another professor in your department whom you trust, and have a confidential conversation about the appropriateness of your advisor's demands versus the general attitude of the department. Sometimes you'll find that "nearly everybody does that" and sometimes they'll say "that's unacceptable."



          If you consult with other professors and you get the impression that you are in the right, you will have more clout in dealing with the issue if your advisor becomes obstinate and makes a big deal out of it. But beware, all of the professors in your department are probably friends, or even worse they could be extremely factionalized. In either case, you run the risk of this "private" conversation being circulated around the proverbial "teacher's lounge."



          Unless you are in an insanely competitive field at a flagship research university, I don't think this is going to blow up in your face. But only you can make the judgement for yourself.



          After conversing with a trusted faculty member, I recommend you next present your concerns to your advisor, and see if he is willing to be reasonable about this. If he still isn't, this is a situation where you might need to get the administration involved, but they largely bend to the whims of tenured faculty members who bring in the big bucks with their research.



          There should be a discussion here on the benefits versus detractors of submitting to your professor and having your name published second on the paper...versus not having your research published at all. I am a somewhat stubborn person and refuse to let anyone take credit for my work. But this might not be the most expedient approach for a person who is trying to get his/her name on publications under any circumstance. You'll have to decide which one you are, and I hope some other folks chime in on this particular subtopic.



          addendum: If you produced your research using a program or model developed by your advisor, or some kind of privileged archival/digital/etc. access through your advisor that you'd otherwise not be able to use, I can see his demand being slightly more legitimized, so consider that as well.






          share|improve this answer


























          • While I respect your opinion here and agree with much of it, note that it isn't really an Ivy League issue. Some fields just expect that advisors and supervisors and such are first author. Fact of life that is hard to counter. Since it is expected in those fields, it seems odd if you do it differently. Use the professor to get your degree and move on with one or more publications.

            – Buffy
            3 hours ago











          • This is the kind of counterpoint I was looking for. It is probably more expedient to allow the advisor to take credit if the promise of future publication or securing a job is high. There isn't too much consequence if the research is not groundbreaking. However, if OP developed some novel AI model that's going to change the world, I certainly would recommend he press the advisor on authorship.

            – Umbrella_Programmer
            3 hours ago



















          2














          It isn't a good career move to counter your advisor in things like this. You need him to sign your thesis (already done) and to write you a good letter of recommendation - maybe still to come. If you anger him, whether rightly or wrongly, it will be you that pays the price.



          As I said in a comment, this kind of "authorship" is common, accepted, and perfectly natural in some fields, even if it is a bit stupid.



          Having joint authorship with a professor can actually be a help to your career, even if he takes first authorship. Some people will just assume that he did all of the work (no matter the order of authorship), carrying you along. Others will just assume that you did all the work and he is first author by curtesy. This is something you can't control.



          But a publication with your name on it anywhere is a plus for your career.



          If you want to fight a system that you think is stupid, wait until you have some power and standing in academia to back you up. Otherwise you get squashed before you have a chance to fly.



          Work with him and get a good letter.



          I realize this isn't the answer you wanted to read. But think in the long term, not the short.






          share|improve this answer





















          • 1





            It is perhaps common, but it's neither universally accepted nor natural.

            – einpoklum
            1 hour ago











          • Thanks for your reply. Fortunately, I have already graduated, moved on and do not need his letter of recommendation.

            – user105565
            1 hour ago



















          1















          Can I argue with him and tell him I am not letting the article to be published if he insists on being the first author?




          Other answers have already indicated this is potentially a somewhat dangerous move if you plan on continuing your academic work.



          However, I believe that you can and perhaps you should. It would be especially useful if you could bring examples of similar cases - with the same advisor or in the same department or subfield - where the advisor was credited last.



          On the other hand, you write that




          My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments.




          "only"? If he was guiding you the whole time and giving you comments all the time, isn't it possible that the research progressed in a way that he envisioned? Perhaps you're misjudging the extent of his contribution. While the work you did seems arduous to you, that's partly because you're new; perhaps for a more experienced researcher, you just did the "grunt work". I'm not saying that this is necessarily the case, but don't go arguing with your advisor unless you can be certain this point of view cannot be defended.





          Finally, another alternative I would suggest, on principle and irrespective of who did how much, is alphabetical order of naming. The practice of listing names by order of decreasing contribution is very problematic and IMHO should be countered in general. Author names should be listed alphabetically, and if the authors do not explain who did what then people can just ask; or better yet - not ask. Of course, the advisor might theoretically be even more averse to that than to being listed second; it depends.






          share|improve this answer
























          • Thanks for your answer. He provided me with the resources (lab) and offered me to work in that project. However, I did all the experiments needed (without help) and wrote the whole paper based on my thesis. Of course, the research progressed in a way that he envisioned but it was because of my findings. As a student, I did what he wanted me to do but I don't think this disqualifies me from being the first author.

            – user105565
            1 hour ago



















          1















          Can I argue with him...




          Rather than taking a starting position where you want to get in an argument, a much better approach would be to try to have a mature conversation where you can each agree on what your contribution to the paper was, and what each of you feel is the appropriate criteria for first authorship. Ask your supervisor for his opinions on this matter, and be open-minded and respectful. If you have a different opinion, then let him know your contrary view, and let him know that you are feeling aggrieved.



          It is not unreasonable for you to raise authorship concerns with your supervisor. This is a conversation that is a legitimate part of joint research work, so you don't need to repress this. However, like all professional matters, it should be raised in a respectful and professional way. Begin by assuming good faith on the part of your supervisor, and don't start off framing the matter as an "argument" you need to have. Try to figure out where you agree and where you disagree, and just be mindful to make sure you don't allow your frustrations to lead to escalation into an unproductive conversation.



          Before raising this matter with your supervisor, it would be a good idea for you to read some material on authorship conventions so that you are able to put your case with some support for outside sources (e.g., see this report). However, you should expect to have a preliminary meeting where your only initial goal is to exchange views on the matter, and then allow each party to go away to consider the views of the other. An initial conversation on this topic might end in disagreement, but if you can support your own view with reputable outside sources, that is likely to be more persuasive than if you cannot.



          These kinds of cases really shouldn't arise, since supervisors and students should always discuss authorship expectation before they begin a research project and papers. I think your supervisor probably made a mistake in not discussing this up-front with you before the work on the paper was done. Even if you are unable to resolve this particular disagreement, it would be a good idea to formulate clear expectations on future papers with your supervisor. Inquire into the requirements he would expect for you to be first author on a paper.




          I did all the lab research and writing of the manuscript. My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments. ...




          If that is an accurate description of the contributions (who came up with the research idea?) then it does not sound to me like enough to warrant first authorship on the part of your supervisor. Conventions will vary from field to field, but in my understanding, the first author should generally be the person who did the most work on the paper. (When I have supervised students in research projects they have always been the lead author on the resulting papers, except in one case where I did the majority of the work on the paper and wrote the first draft.) Ethical guidelines on authorship, such as in the linked report, may give some guidance and references discussing authorship-order, so these are worth reviewing.






          share|improve this answer

























            Your Answer








            StackExchange.ready(function() {
            var channelOptions = {
            tags: "".split(" "),
            id: "415"
            };
            initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

            StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
            // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
            if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
            StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
            createEditor();
            });
            }
            else {
            createEditor();
            }
            });

            function createEditor() {
            StackExchange.prepareEditor({
            heartbeatType: 'answer',
            autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
            convertImagesToLinks: true,
            noModals: true,
            showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
            reputationToPostImages: 10,
            bindNavPrevention: true,
            postfix: "",
            imageUploader: {
            brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
            contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
            allowUrls: true
            },
            noCode: true, onDemand: true,
            discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
            ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
            });


            }
            });






            user105565 is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.










            draft saved

            draft discarded


















            StackExchange.ready(
            function () {
            StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2facademia.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f126431%2fmy-adviser-wants-to-be-the-first-author%23new-answer', 'question_page');
            }
            );

            Post as a guest















            Required, but never shown

























            4 Answers
            4






            active

            oldest

            votes








            4 Answers
            4






            active

            oldest

            votes









            active

            oldest

            votes






            active

            oldest

            votes









            2














            Occasionally (and more than occasionally in private / Ivy League institutions), professors will have their names credited as the primary author of a paper that was produced by their graduate advisees. In my view it is unethical, but in the eyes of some academics, it's customary. Some professors view their advisees as underlings to further his or her brand recognition in whichever field he/she works in.



            in my view, your advisor is in fact not the author, if it's true that you did the research and literally wrote the paper. Before confronting him about it or giving him an ultimatum, I would go to another professor in your department whom you trust, and have a confidential conversation about the appropriateness of your advisor's demands versus the general attitude of the department. Sometimes you'll find that "nearly everybody does that" and sometimes they'll say "that's unacceptable."



            If you consult with other professors and you get the impression that you are in the right, you will have more clout in dealing with the issue if your advisor becomes obstinate and makes a big deal out of it. But beware, all of the professors in your department are probably friends, or even worse they could be extremely factionalized. In either case, you run the risk of this "private" conversation being circulated around the proverbial "teacher's lounge."



            Unless you are in an insanely competitive field at a flagship research university, I don't think this is going to blow up in your face. But only you can make the judgement for yourself.



            After conversing with a trusted faculty member, I recommend you next present your concerns to your advisor, and see if he is willing to be reasonable about this. If he still isn't, this is a situation where you might need to get the administration involved, but they largely bend to the whims of tenured faculty members who bring in the big bucks with their research.



            There should be a discussion here on the benefits versus detractors of submitting to your professor and having your name published second on the paper...versus not having your research published at all. I am a somewhat stubborn person and refuse to let anyone take credit for my work. But this might not be the most expedient approach for a person who is trying to get his/her name on publications under any circumstance. You'll have to decide which one you are, and I hope some other folks chime in on this particular subtopic.



            addendum: If you produced your research using a program or model developed by your advisor, or some kind of privileged archival/digital/etc. access through your advisor that you'd otherwise not be able to use, I can see his demand being slightly more legitimized, so consider that as well.






            share|improve this answer


























            • While I respect your opinion here and agree with much of it, note that it isn't really an Ivy League issue. Some fields just expect that advisors and supervisors and such are first author. Fact of life that is hard to counter. Since it is expected in those fields, it seems odd if you do it differently. Use the professor to get your degree and move on with one or more publications.

              – Buffy
              3 hours ago











            • This is the kind of counterpoint I was looking for. It is probably more expedient to allow the advisor to take credit if the promise of future publication or securing a job is high. There isn't too much consequence if the research is not groundbreaking. However, if OP developed some novel AI model that's going to change the world, I certainly would recommend he press the advisor on authorship.

              – Umbrella_Programmer
              3 hours ago
















            2














            Occasionally (and more than occasionally in private / Ivy League institutions), professors will have their names credited as the primary author of a paper that was produced by their graduate advisees. In my view it is unethical, but in the eyes of some academics, it's customary. Some professors view their advisees as underlings to further his or her brand recognition in whichever field he/she works in.



            in my view, your advisor is in fact not the author, if it's true that you did the research and literally wrote the paper. Before confronting him about it or giving him an ultimatum, I would go to another professor in your department whom you trust, and have a confidential conversation about the appropriateness of your advisor's demands versus the general attitude of the department. Sometimes you'll find that "nearly everybody does that" and sometimes they'll say "that's unacceptable."



            If you consult with other professors and you get the impression that you are in the right, you will have more clout in dealing with the issue if your advisor becomes obstinate and makes a big deal out of it. But beware, all of the professors in your department are probably friends, or even worse they could be extremely factionalized. In either case, you run the risk of this "private" conversation being circulated around the proverbial "teacher's lounge."



            Unless you are in an insanely competitive field at a flagship research university, I don't think this is going to blow up in your face. But only you can make the judgement for yourself.



            After conversing with a trusted faculty member, I recommend you next present your concerns to your advisor, and see if he is willing to be reasonable about this. If he still isn't, this is a situation where you might need to get the administration involved, but they largely bend to the whims of tenured faculty members who bring in the big bucks with their research.



            There should be a discussion here on the benefits versus detractors of submitting to your professor and having your name published second on the paper...versus not having your research published at all. I am a somewhat stubborn person and refuse to let anyone take credit for my work. But this might not be the most expedient approach for a person who is trying to get his/her name on publications under any circumstance. You'll have to decide which one you are, and I hope some other folks chime in on this particular subtopic.



            addendum: If you produced your research using a program or model developed by your advisor, or some kind of privileged archival/digital/etc. access through your advisor that you'd otherwise not be able to use, I can see his demand being slightly more legitimized, so consider that as well.






            share|improve this answer


























            • While I respect your opinion here and agree with much of it, note that it isn't really an Ivy League issue. Some fields just expect that advisors and supervisors and such are first author. Fact of life that is hard to counter. Since it is expected in those fields, it seems odd if you do it differently. Use the professor to get your degree and move on with one or more publications.

              – Buffy
              3 hours ago











            • This is the kind of counterpoint I was looking for. It is probably more expedient to allow the advisor to take credit if the promise of future publication or securing a job is high. There isn't too much consequence if the research is not groundbreaking. However, if OP developed some novel AI model that's going to change the world, I certainly would recommend he press the advisor on authorship.

              – Umbrella_Programmer
              3 hours ago














            2












            2








            2







            Occasionally (and more than occasionally in private / Ivy League institutions), professors will have their names credited as the primary author of a paper that was produced by their graduate advisees. In my view it is unethical, but in the eyes of some academics, it's customary. Some professors view their advisees as underlings to further his or her brand recognition in whichever field he/she works in.



            in my view, your advisor is in fact not the author, if it's true that you did the research and literally wrote the paper. Before confronting him about it or giving him an ultimatum, I would go to another professor in your department whom you trust, and have a confidential conversation about the appropriateness of your advisor's demands versus the general attitude of the department. Sometimes you'll find that "nearly everybody does that" and sometimes they'll say "that's unacceptable."



            If you consult with other professors and you get the impression that you are in the right, you will have more clout in dealing with the issue if your advisor becomes obstinate and makes a big deal out of it. But beware, all of the professors in your department are probably friends, or even worse they could be extremely factionalized. In either case, you run the risk of this "private" conversation being circulated around the proverbial "teacher's lounge."



            Unless you are in an insanely competitive field at a flagship research university, I don't think this is going to blow up in your face. But only you can make the judgement for yourself.



            After conversing with a trusted faculty member, I recommend you next present your concerns to your advisor, and see if he is willing to be reasonable about this. If he still isn't, this is a situation where you might need to get the administration involved, but they largely bend to the whims of tenured faculty members who bring in the big bucks with their research.



            There should be a discussion here on the benefits versus detractors of submitting to your professor and having your name published second on the paper...versus not having your research published at all. I am a somewhat stubborn person and refuse to let anyone take credit for my work. But this might not be the most expedient approach for a person who is trying to get his/her name on publications under any circumstance. You'll have to decide which one you are, and I hope some other folks chime in on this particular subtopic.



            addendum: If you produced your research using a program or model developed by your advisor, or some kind of privileged archival/digital/etc. access through your advisor that you'd otherwise not be able to use, I can see his demand being slightly more legitimized, so consider that as well.






            share|improve this answer















            Occasionally (and more than occasionally in private / Ivy League institutions), professors will have their names credited as the primary author of a paper that was produced by their graduate advisees. In my view it is unethical, but in the eyes of some academics, it's customary. Some professors view their advisees as underlings to further his or her brand recognition in whichever field he/she works in.



            in my view, your advisor is in fact not the author, if it's true that you did the research and literally wrote the paper. Before confronting him about it or giving him an ultimatum, I would go to another professor in your department whom you trust, and have a confidential conversation about the appropriateness of your advisor's demands versus the general attitude of the department. Sometimes you'll find that "nearly everybody does that" and sometimes they'll say "that's unacceptable."



            If you consult with other professors and you get the impression that you are in the right, you will have more clout in dealing with the issue if your advisor becomes obstinate and makes a big deal out of it. But beware, all of the professors in your department are probably friends, or even worse they could be extremely factionalized. In either case, you run the risk of this "private" conversation being circulated around the proverbial "teacher's lounge."



            Unless you are in an insanely competitive field at a flagship research university, I don't think this is going to blow up in your face. But only you can make the judgement for yourself.



            After conversing with a trusted faculty member, I recommend you next present your concerns to your advisor, and see if he is willing to be reasonable about this. If he still isn't, this is a situation where you might need to get the administration involved, but they largely bend to the whims of tenured faculty members who bring in the big bucks with their research.



            There should be a discussion here on the benefits versus detractors of submitting to your professor and having your name published second on the paper...versus not having your research published at all. I am a somewhat stubborn person and refuse to let anyone take credit for my work. But this might not be the most expedient approach for a person who is trying to get his/her name on publications under any circumstance. You'll have to decide which one you are, and I hope some other folks chime in on this particular subtopic.



            addendum: If you produced your research using a program or model developed by your advisor, or some kind of privileged archival/digital/etc. access through your advisor that you'd otherwise not be able to use, I can see his demand being slightly more legitimized, so consider that as well.







            share|improve this answer














            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer








            edited 3 hours ago

























            answered 4 hours ago









            Umbrella_ProgrammerUmbrella_Programmer

            3495




            3495













            • While I respect your opinion here and agree with much of it, note that it isn't really an Ivy League issue. Some fields just expect that advisors and supervisors and such are first author. Fact of life that is hard to counter. Since it is expected in those fields, it seems odd if you do it differently. Use the professor to get your degree and move on with one or more publications.

              – Buffy
              3 hours ago











            • This is the kind of counterpoint I was looking for. It is probably more expedient to allow the advisor to take credit if the promise of future publication or securing a job is high. There isn't too much consequence if the research is not groundbreaking. However, if OP developed some novel AI model that's going to change the world, I certainly would recommend he press the advisor on authorship.

              – Umbrella_Programmer
              3 hours ago



















            • While I respect your opinion here and agree with much of it, note that it isn't really an Ivy League issue. Some fields just expect that advisors and supervisors and such are first author. Fact of life that is hard to counter. Since it is expected in those fields, it seems odd if you do it differently. Use the professor to get your degree and move on with one or more publications.

              – Buffy
              3 hours ago











            • This is the kind of counterpoint I was looking for. It is probably more expedient to allow the advisor to take credit if the promise of future publication or securing a job is high. There isn't too much consequence if the research is not groundbreaking. However, if OP developed some novel AI model that's going to change the world, I certainly would recommend he press the advisor on authorship.

              – Umbrella_Programmer
              3 hours ago

















            While I respect your opinion here and agree with much of it, note that it isn't really an Ivy League issue. Some fields just expect that advisors and supervisors and such are first author. Fact of life that is hard to counter. Since it is expected in those fields, it seems odd if you do it differently. Use the professor to get your degree and move on with one or more publications.

            – Buffy
            3 hours ago





            While I respect your opinion here and agree with much of it, note that it isn't really an Ivy League issue. Some fields just expect that advisors and supervisors and such are first author. Fact of life that is hard to counter. Since it is expected in those fields, it seems odd if you do it differently. Use the professor to get your degree and move on with one or more publications.

            – Buffy
            3 hours ago













            This is the kind of counterpoint I was looking for. It is probably more expedient to allow the advisor to take credit if the promise of future publication or securing a job is high. There isn't too much consequence if the research is not groundbreaking. However, if OP developed some novel AI model that's going to change the world, I certainly would recommend he press the advisor on authorship.

            – Umbrella_Programmer
            3 hours ago





            This is the kind of counterpoint I was looking for. It is probably more expedient to allow the advisor to take credit if the promise of future publication or securing a job is high. There isn't too much consequence if the research is not groundbreaking. However, if OP developed some novel AI model that's going to change the world, I certainly would recommend he press the advisor on authorship.

            – Umbrella_Programmer
            3 hours ago











            2














            It isn't a good career move to counter your advisor in things like this. You need him to sign your thesis (already done) and to write you a good letter of recommendation - maybe still to come. If you anger him, whether rightly or wrongly, it will be you that pays the price.



            As I said in a comment, this kind of "authorship" is common, accepted, and perfectly natural in some fields, even if it is a bit stupid.



            Having joint authorship with a professor can actually be a help to your career, even if he takes first authorship. Some people will just assume that he did all of the work (no matter the order of authorship), carrying you along. Others will just assume that you did all the work and he is first author by curtesy. This is something you can't control.



            But a publication with your name on it anywhere is a plus for your career.



            If you want to fight a system that you think is stupid, wait until you have some power and standing in academia to back you up. Otherwise you get squashed before you have a chance to fly.



            Work with him and get a good letter.



            I realize this isn't the answer you wanted to read. But think in the long term, not the short.






            share|improve this answer





















            • 1





              It is perhaps common, but it's neither universally accepted nor natural.

              – einpoklum
              1 hour ago











            • Thanks for your reply. Fortunately, I have already graduated, moved on and do not need his letter of recommendation.

              – user105565
              1 hour ago
















            2














            It isn't a good career move to counter your advisor in things like this. You need him to sign your thesis (already done) and to write you a good letter of recommendation - maybe still to come. If you anger him, whether rightly or wrongly, it will be you that pays the price.



            As I said in a comment, this kind of "authorship" is common, accepted, and perfectly natural in some fields, even if it is a bit stupid.



            Having joint authorship with a professor can actually be a help to your career, even if he takes first authorship. Some people will just assume that he did all of the work (no matter the order of authorship), carrying you along. Others will just assume that you did all the work and he is first author by curtesy. This is something you can't control.



            But a publication with your name on it anywhere is a plus for your career.



            If you want to fight a system that you think is stupid, wait until you have some power and standing in academia to back you up. Otherwise you get squashed before you have a chance to fly.



            Work with him and get a good letter.



            I realize this isn't the answer you wanted to read. But think in the long term, not the short.






            share|improve this answer





















            • 1





              It is perhaps common, but it's neither universally accepted nor natural.

              – einpoklum
              1 hour ago











            • Thanks for your reply. Fortunately, I have already graduated, moved on and do not need his letter of recommendation.

              – user105565
              1 hour ago














            2












            2








            2







            It isn't a good career move to counter your advisor in things like this. You need him to sign your thesis (already done) and to write you a good letter of recommendation - maybe still to come. If you anger him, whether rightly or wrongly, it will be you that pays the price.



            As I said in a comment, this kind of "authorship" is common, accepted, and perfectly natural in some fields, even if it is a bit stupid.



            Having joint authorship with a professor can actually be a help to your career, even if he takes first authorship. Some people will just assume that he did all of the work (no matter the order of authorship), carrying you along. Others will just assume that you did all the work and he is first author by curtesy. This is something you can't control.



            But a publication with your name on it anywhere is a plus for your career.



            If you want to fight a system that you think is stupid, wait until you have some power and standing in academia to back you up. Otherwise you get squashed before you have a chance to fly.



            Work with him and get a good letter.



            I realize this isn't the answer you wanted to read. But think in the long term, not the short.






            share|improve this answer















            It isn't a good career move to counter your advisor in things like this. You need him to sign your thesis (already done) and to write you a good letter of recommendation - maybe still to come. If you anger him, whether rightly or wrongly, it will be you that pays the price.



            As I said in a comment, this kind of "authorship" is common, accepted, and perfectly natural in some fields, even if it is a bit stupid.



            Having joint authorship with a professor can actually be a help to your career, even if he takes first authorship. Some people will just assume that he did all of the work (no matter the order of authorship), carrying you along. Others will just assume that you did all the work and he is first author by curtesy. This is something you can't control.



            But a publication with your name on it anywhere is a plus for your career.



            If you want to fight a system that you think is stupid, wait until you have some power and standing in academia to back you up. Otherwise you get squashed before you have a chance to fly.



            Work with him and get a good letter.



            I realize this isn't the answer you wanted to read. But think in the long term, not the short.







            share|improve this answer














            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer








            edited 3 hours ago

























            answered 3 hours ago









            BuffyBuffy

            52.1k14168258




            52.1k14168258








            • 1





              It is perhaps common, but it's neither universally accepted nor natural.

              – einpoklum
              1 hour ago











            • Thanks for your reply. Fortunately, I have already graduated, moved on and do not need his letter of recommendation.

              – user105565
              1 hour ago














            • 1





              It is perhaps common, but it's neither universally accepted nor natural.

              – einpoklum
              1 hour ago











            • Thanks for your reply. Fortunately, I have already graduated, moved on and do not need his letter of recommendation.

              – user105565
              1 hour ago








            1




            1





            It is perhaps common, but it's neither universally accepted nor natural.

            – einpoklum
            1 hour ago





            It is perhaps common, but it's neither universally accepted nor natural.

            – einpoklum
            1 hour ago













            Thanks for your reply. Fortunately, I have already graduated, moved on and do not need his letter of recommendation.

            – user105565
            1 hour ago





            Thanks for your reply. Fortunately, I have already graduated, moved on and do not need his letter of recommendation.

            – user105565
            1 hour ago











            1















            Can I argue with him and tell him I am not letting the article to be published if he insists on being the first author?




            Other answers have already indicated this is potentially a somewhat dangerous move if you plan on continuing your academic work.



            However, I believe that you can and perhaps you should. It would be especially useful if you could bring examples of similar cases - with the same advisor or in the same department or subfield - where the advisor was credited last.



            On the other hand, you write that




            My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments.




            "only"? If he was guiding you the whole time and giving you comments all the time, isn't it possible that the research progressed in a way that he envisioned? Perhaps you're misjudging the extent of his contribution. While the work you did seems arduous to you, that's partly because you're new; perhaps for a more experienced researcher, you just did the "grunt work". I'm not saying that this is necessarily the case, but don't go arguing with your advisor unless you can be certain this point of view cannot be defended.





            Finally, another alternative I would suggest, on principle and irrespective of who did how much, is alphabetical order of naming. The practice of listing names by order of decreasing contribution is very problematic and IMHO should be countered in general. Author names should be listed alphabetically, and if the authors do not explain who did what then people can just ask; or better yet - not ask. Of course, the advisor might theoretically be even more averse to that than to being listed second; it depends.






            share|improve this answer
























            • Thanks for your answer. He provided me with the resources (lab) and offered me to work in that project. However, I did all the experiments needed (without help) and wrote the whole paper based on my thesis. Of course, the research progressed in a way that he envisioned but it was because of my findings. As a student, I did what he wanted me to do but I don't think this disqualifies me from being the first author.

              – user105565
              1 hour ago
















            1















            Can I argue with him and tell him I am not letting the article to be published if he insists on being the first author?




            Other answers have already indicated this is potentially a somewhat dangerous move if you plan on continuing your academic work.



            However, I believe that you can and perhaps you should. It would be especially useful if you could bring examples of similar cases - with the same advisor or in the same department or subfield - where the advisor was credited last.



            On the other hand, you write that




            My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments.




            "only"? If he was guiding you the whole time and giving you comments all the time, isn't it possible that the research progressed in a way that he envisioned? Perhaps you're misjudging the extent of his contribution. While the work you did seems arduous to you, that's partly because you're new; perhaps for a more experienced researcher, you just did the "grunt work". I'm not saying that this is necessarily the case, but don't go arguing with your advisor unless you can be certain this point of view cannot be defended.





            Finally, another alternative I would suggest, on principle and irrespective of who did how much, is alphabetical order of naming. The practice of listing names by order of decreasing contribution is very problematic and IMHO should be countered in general. Author names should be listed alphabetically, and if the authors do not explain who did what then people can just ask; or better yet - not ask. Of course, the advisor might theoretically be even more averse to that than to being listed second; it depends.






            share|improve this answer
























            • Thanks for your answer. He provided me with the resources (lab) and offered me to work in that project. However, I did all the experiments needed (without help) and wrote the whole paper based on my thesis. Of course, the research progressed in a way that he envisioned but it was because of my findings. As a student, I did what he wanted me to do but I don't think this disqualifies me from being the first author.

              – user105565
              1 hour ago














            1












            1








            1








            Can I argue with him and tell him I am not letting the article to be published if he insists on being the first author?




            Other answers have already indicated this is potentially a somewhat dangerous move if you plan on continuing your academic work.



            However, I believe that you can and perhaps you should. It would be especially useful if you could bring examples of similar cases - with the same advisor or in the same department or subfield - where the advisor was credited last.



            On the other hand, you write that




            My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments.




            "only"? If he was guiding you the whole time and giving you comments all the time, isn't it possible that the research progressed in a way that he envisioned? Perhaps you're misjudging the extent of his contribution. While the work you did seems arduous to you, that's partly because you're new; perhaps for a more experienced researcher, you just did the "grunt work". I'm not saying that this is necessarily the case, but don't go arguing with your advisor unless you can be certain this point of view cannot be defended.





            Finally, another alternative I would suggest, on principle and irrespective of who did how much, is alphabetical order of naming. The practice of listing names by order of decreasing contribution is very problematic and IMHO should be countered in general. Author names should be listed alphabetically, and if the authors do not explain who did what then people can just ask; or better yet - not ask. Of course, the advisor might theoretically be even more averse to that than to being listed second; it depends.






            share|improve this answer














            Can I argue with him and tell him I am not letting the article to be published if he insists on being the first author?




            Other answers have already indicated this is potentially a somewhat dangerous move if you plan on continuing your academic work.



            However, I believe that you can and perhaps you should. It would be especially useful if you could bring examples of similar cases - with the same advisor or in the same department or subfield - where the advisor was credited last.



            On the other hand, you write that




            My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments.




            "only"? If he was guiding you the whole time and giving you comments all the time, isn't it possible that the research progressed in a way that he envisioned? Perhaps you're misjudging the extent of his contribution. While the work you did seems arduous to you, that's partly because you're new; perhaps for a more experienced researcher, you just did the "grunt work". I'm not saying that this is necessarily the case, but don't go arguing with your advisor unless you can be certain this point of view cannot be defended.





            Finally, another alternative I would suggest, on principle and irrespective of who did how much, is alphabetical order of naming. The practice of listing names by order of decreasing contribution is very problematic and IMHO should be countered in general. Author names should be listed alphabetically, and if the authors do not explain who did what then people can just ask; or better yet - not ask. Of course, the advisor might theoretically be even more averse to that than to being listed second; it depends.







            share|improve this answer












            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer










            answered 1 hour ago









            einpoklumeinpoklum

            24.5k138141




            24.5k138141













            • Thanks for your answer. He provided me with the resources (lab) and offered me to work in that project. However, I did all the experiments needed (without help) and wrote the whole paper based on my thesis. Of course, the research progressed in a way that he envisioned but it was because of my findings. As a student, I did what he wanted me to do but I don't think this disqualifies me from being the first author.

              – user105565
              1 hour ago



















            • Thanks for your answer. He provided me with the resources (lab) and offered me to work in that project. However, I did all the experiments needed (without help) and wrote the whole paper based on my thesis. Of course, the research progressed in a way that he envisioned but it was because of my findings. As a student, I did what he wanted me to do but I don't think this disqualifies me from being the first author.

              – user105565
              1 hour ago

















            Thanks for your answer. He provided me with the resources (lab) and offered me to work in that project. However, I did all the experiments needed (without help) and wrote the whole paper based on my thesis. Of course, the research progressed in a way that he envisioned but it was because of my findings. As a student, I did what he wanted me to do but I don't think this disqualifies me from being the first author.

            – user105565
            1 hour ago





            Thanks for your answer. He provided me with the resources (lab) and offered me to work in that project. However, I did all the experiments needed (without help) and wrote the whole paper based on my thesis. Of course, the research progressed in a way that he envisioned but it was because of my findings. As a student, I did what he wanted me to do but I don't think this disqualifies me from being the first author.

            – user105565
            1 hour ago











            1















            Can I argue with him...




            Rather than taking a starting position where you want to get in an argument, a much better approach would be to try to have a mature conversation where you can each agree on what your contribution to the paper was, and what each of you feel is the appropriate criteria for first authorship. Ask your supervisor for his opinions on this matter, and be open-minded and respectful. If you have a different opinion, then let him know your contrary view, and let him know that you are feeling aggrieved.



            It is not unreasonable for you to raise authorship concerns with your supervisor. This is a conversation that is a legitimate part of joint research work, so you don't need to repress this. However, like all professional matters, it should be raised in a respectful and professional way. Begin by assuming good faith on the part of your supervisor, and don't start off framing the matter as an "argument" you need to have. Try to figure out where you agree and where you disagree, and just be mindful to make sure you don't allow your frustrations to lead to escalation into an unproductive conversation.



            Before raising this matter with your supervisor, it would be a good idea for you to read some material on authorship conventions so that you are able to put your case with some support for outside sources (e.g., see this report). However, you should expect to have a preliminary meeting where your only initial goal is to exchange views on the matter, and then allow each party to go away to consider the views of the other. An initial conversation on this topic might end in disagreement, but if you can support your own view with reputable outside sources, that is likely to be more persuasive than if you cannot.



            These kinds of cases really shouldn't arise, since supervisors and students should always discuss authorship expectation before they begin a research project and papers. I think your supervisor probably made a mistake in not discussing this up-front with you before the work on the paper was done. Even if you are unable to resolve this particular disagreement, it would be a good idea to formulate clear expectations on future papers with your supervisor. Inquire into the requirements he would expect for you to be first author on a paper.




            I did all the lab research and writing of the manuscript. My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments. ...




            If that is an accurate description of the contributions (who came up with the research idea?) then it does not sound to me like enough to warrant first authorship on the part of your supervisor. Conventions will vary from field to field, but in my understanding, the first author should generally be the person who did the most work on the paper. (When I have supervised students in research projects they have always been the lead author on the resulting papers, except in one case where I did the majority of the work on the paper and wrote the first draft.) Ethical guidelines on authorship, such as in the linked report, may give some guidance and references discussing authorship-order, so these are worth reviewing.






            share|improve this answer






























              1















              Can I argue with him...




              Rather than taking a starting position where you want to get in an argument, a much better approach would be to try to have a mature conversation where you can each agree on what your contribution to the paper was, and what each of you feel is the appropriate criteria for first authorship. Ask your supervisor for his opinions on this matter, and be open-minded and respectful. If you have a different opinion, then let him know your contrary view, and let him know that you are feeling aggrieved.



              It is not unreasonable for you to raise authorship concerns with your supervisor. This is a conversation that is a legitimate part of joint research work, so you don't need to repress this. However, like all professional matters, it should be raised in a respectful and professional way. Begin by assuming good faith on the part of your supervisor, and don't start off framing the matter as an "argument" you need to have. Try to figure out where you agree and where you disagree, and just be mindful to make sure you don't allow your frustrations to lead to escalation into an unproductive conversation.



              Before raising this matter with your supervisor, it would be a good idea for you to read some material on authorship conventions so that you are able to put your case with some support for outside sources (e.g., see this report). However, you should expect to have a preliminary meeting where your only initial goal is to exchange views on the matter, and then allow each party to go away to consider the views of the other. An initial conversation on this topic might end in disagreement, but if you can support your own view with reputable outside sources, that is likely to be more persuasive than if you cannot.



              These kinds of cases really shouldn't arise, since supervisors and students should always discuss authorship expectation before they begin a research project and papers. I think your supervisor probably made a mistake in not discussing this up-front with you before the work on the paper was done. Even if you are unable to resolve this particular disagreement, it would be a good idea to formulate clear expectations on future papers with your supervisor. Inquire into the requirements he would expect for you to be first author on a paper.




              I did all the lab research and writing of the manuscript. My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments. ...




              If that is an accurate description of the contributions (who came up with the research idea?) then it does not sound to me like enough to warrant first authorship on the part of your supervisor. Conventions will vary from field to field, but in my understanding, the first author should generally be the person who did the most work on the paper. (When I have supervised students in research projects they have always been the lead author on the resulting papers, except in one case where I did the majority of the work on the paper and wrote the first draft.) Ethical guidelines on authorship, such as in the linked report, may give some guidance and references discussing authorship-order, so these are worth reviewing.






              share|improve this answer




























                1












                1








                1








                Can I argue with him...




                Rather than taking a starting position where you want to get in an argument, a much better approach would be to try to have a mature conversation where you can each agree on what your contribution to the paper was, and what each of you feel is the appropriate criteria for first authorship. Ask your supervisor for his opinions on this matter, and be open-minded and respectful. If you have a different opinion, then let him know your contrary view, and let him know that you are feeling aggrieved.



                It is not unreasonable for you to raise authorship concerns with your supervisor. This is a conversation that is a legitimate part of joint research work, so you don't need to repress this. However, like all professional matters, it should be raised in a respectful and professional way. Begin by assuming good faith on the part of your supervisor, and don't start off framing the matter as an "argument" you need to have. Try to figure out where you agree and where you disagree, and just be mindful to make sure you don't allow your frustrations to lead to escalation into an unproductive conversation.



                Before raising this matter with your supervisor, it would be a good idea for you to read some material on authorship conventions so that you are able to put your case with some support for outside sources (e.g., see this report). However, you should expect to have a preliminary meeting where your only initial goal is to exchange views on the matter, and then allow each party to go away to consider the views of the other. An initial conversation on this topic might end in disagreement, but if you can support your own view with reputable outside sources, that is likely to be more persuasive than if you cannot.



                These kinds of cases really shouldn't arise, since supervisors and students should always discuss authorship expectation before they begin a research project and papers. I think your supervisor probably made a mistake in not discussing this up-front with you before the work on the paper was done. Even if you are unable to resolve this particular disagreement, it would be a good idea to formulate clear expectations on future papers with your supervisor. Inquire into the requirements he would expect for you to be first author on a paper.




                I did all the lab research and writing of the manuscript. My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments. ...




                If that is an accurate description of the contributions (who came up with the research idea?) then it does not sound to me like enough to warrant first authorship on the part of your supervisor. Conventions will vary from field to field, but in my understanding, the first author should generally be the person who did the most work on the paper. (When I have supervised students in research projects they have always been the lead author on the resulting papers, except in one case where I did the majority of the work on the paper and wrote the first draft.) Ethical guidelines on authorship, such as in the linked report, may give some guidance and references discussing authorship-order, so these are worth reviewing.






                share|improve this answer
















                Can I argue with him...




                Rather than taking a starting position where you want to get in an argument, a much better approach would be to try to have a mature conversation where you can each agree on what your contribution to the paper was, and what each of you feel is the appropriate criteria for first authorship. Ask your supervisor for his opinions on this matter, and be open-minded and respectful. If you have a different opinion, then let him know your contrary view, and let him know that you are feeling aggrieved.



                It is not unreasonable for you to raise authorship concerns with your supervisor. This is a conversation that is a legitimate part of joint research work, so you don't need to repress this. However, like all professional matters, it should be raised in a respectful and professional way. Begin by assuming good faith on the part of your supervisor, and don't start off framing the matter as an "argument" you need to have. Try to figure out where you agree and where you disagree, and just be mindful to make sure you don't allow your frustrations to lead to escalation into an unproductive conversation.



                Before raising this matter with your supervisor, it would be a good idea for you to read some material on authorship conventions so that you are able to put your case with some support for outside sources (e.g., see this report). However, you should expect to have a preliminary meeting where your only initial goal is to exchange views on the matter, and then allow each party to go away to consider the views of the other. An initial conversation on this topic might end in disagreement, but if you can support your own view with reputable outside sources, that is likely to be more persuasive than if you cannot.



                These kinds of cases really shouldn't arise, since supervisors and students should always discuss authorship expectation before they begin a research project and papers. I think your supervisor probably made a mistake in not discussing this up-front with you before the work on the paper was done. Even if you are unable to resolve this particular disagreement, it would be a good idea to formulate clear expectations on future papers with your supervisor. Inquire into the requirements he would expect for you to be first author on a paper.




                I did all the lab research and writing of the manuscript. My professor was only involved to guide me throughout the research and read my writing and give his comments. ...




                If that is an accurate description of the contributions (who came up with the research idea?) then it does not sound to me like enough to warrant first authorship on the part of your supervisor. Conventions will vary from field to field, but in my understanding, the first author should generally be the person who did the most work on the paper. (When I have supervised students in research projects they have always been the lead author on the resulting papers, except in one case where I did the majority of the work on the paper and wrote the first draft.) Ethical guidelines on authorship, such as in the linked report, may give some guidance and references discussing authorship-order, so these are worth reviewing.







                share|improve this answer














                share|improve this answer



                share|improve this answer








                edited 24 mins ago

























                answered 36 mins ago









                BenBen

                13.8k33462




                13.8k33462






















                    user105565 is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.










                    draft saved

                    draft discarded


















                    user105565 is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.













                    user105565 is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.












                    user105565 is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
















                    Thanks for contributing an answer to Academia Stack Exchange!


                    • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

                    But avoid



                    • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

                    • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.


                    To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




                    draft saved


                    draft discarded














                    StackExchange.ready(
                    function () {
                    StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2facademia.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f126431%2fmy-adviser-wants-to-be-the-first-author%23new-answer', 'question_page');
                    }
                    );

                    Post as a guest















                    Required, but never shown





















































                    Required, but never shown














                    Required, but never shown












                    Required, but never shown







                    Required, but never shown

































                    Required, but never shown














                    Required, but never shown












                    Required, but never shown







                    Required, but never shown







                    Popular posts from this blog

                    Why do type traits not work with types in namespace scope?What are POD types in C++?Why can templates only be...

                    Will tsunami waves travel forever if there was no land?Why do tsunami waves begin with the water flowing away...

                    Simple Scan not detecting my scanner (Brother DCP-7055W)Brother MFC-L2700DW printer can print, can't...